Intro/Outro (00:04): It takes a bit of a blend of art and science to get baking just right and having extra eyes, ears, and hands can make a big difference along the way. That's where AB Maori, north America comes into play. We are the team behind industrial and artisan bakers that help optimize success. We'll discuss more on this episode of the Oven Light. So let's get going. Flip the switch.

Rick (00:30): Welcome back. Who's ready for the oven? Light? Flip the switch. The switch is back on. We got a great show for you today. Our guest today, I've known for a couple of decades, an engaging character and a voice literally that you want to pay attention to. He's an author, he's a fellow podcaster, he's an award-winning communications executive living on the West coast, also in the Midwest here, I have to say, I have to steal a line and I used to call this out to this gentleman, our guest, and it's taken from the late Stuart Scott, and if you remember him from ESPN, he was an announcer. He was also on the NBC affiliate in Orlando, and that's where I first got exposed to him. But he used to say this line and this defines this person perfectly. He's as cool as the other side of the pillow and I believe it. Ladies and gentlemen, let's welcome Charles K Pool to the program. Good to see you, Charles.

Charles K. Poole (01:26): Hey Rick, good morning and thank you. That is one way to start a great day right there

Rick (01:32): As cool as the other side of the pillow, man. You really are, and you've been that way since I've known you the early two thousands at Anheuser-Busch. So hey, let's start a little bit fun. We're just going to kind of ease into this podcast, lighten the mood a little bit. Alright, you're kind of a well-traveled man. Where's your favorite place you've ever been and why?

Charles K. Poole (01:52): It's a very easy answer, which is the reason that no matter where I am, I always gravitate back to it. I love Los Angeles. I know other people look for other places on the globe, but for me, Los Angeles is it and probably always will be.

Rick (02:08): Are there certain parts of it or, I mean there's a lot to go on in LA and Southern Cal.

Charles K. Poole (02:13): That's because it is so fast, right? Anything you want, any kind of experience you want, any different type of people you want to meet, they're there. And while I've lived there now twice, I've always taken time to explore it very, very slowly so that I could take it all in. There are still parts I've not even gone to yet, but the idea is whatever you're looking for, you can find it there. I'm an urbanite to the extent you can describe it as such, and I am a city guy. In fact, I always tell people I love the smell of asphalt in the morning. I don't really like the country life and that type of thing, but give me a great urban city with lots of amenities and differing people and I'm it.

Rick (02:54): That's awesome. Well, I mean there's always been that long-term debate. Is it New York City or is it la? And I will tell you, I typically pick LA despite the traffic, but I love New York. I love them both.

Charles K. Poole (03:06): Yeah, yeah. I'm with you on New York. I love going and getting lost in New York, dressing completely in something black. Being out there with thousands of people, no one knows who you are and you're just the monks them and you're somehow part of them at the same time. I love it. However, it is a little too close for me. I am somewhat not a touchy-feely person and I need a little bit of space.

Rick (03:28): So okay, let's throw this at you. So you've been to a lot of places. You like la, there's baked goods everywhere, right? We're a baking ingredients company. We make fleischmann's yeast and tons of other things, but is there something out there or was there a special meal and who knows? It could have been bread, it could have been cake, whatever, a donut, and you're like, boy, that is just a great memory.

Charles K. Poole (03:47): Well, the memory really stems from my home, my mom. You mentioned fleischmann's yeast. I know that brand infinitely well because my mom's yeast rolls that she made the house smell like so light and tasty. I can still taste them in memory today. And she made those, that was only yeast I ever knew about. In fact, I didn't know that the world was popularized with any other yeast and that's what I know. So she would make these yeast rolls and other kinds of baked goods as well. But those roll are just legendary

Rick (04:23): By the way. So we are not paying Charles for this. No, you're not. We did not practice this in advance, so I appreciate the commentary. So let me ask you this. During the pandemic, did you get out and bake a little bit and try to reframe your memory and make it real again?

Charles K. Poole (04:36): Well, if I can be candid with you, I can throw it down in the kitchen. My thing is, is that everything that I learned, I learned at the feet of my ma and before her, my grandmother. The challenge is, is it's a southern tradition. It's a southern tradition I come from and we don't know how to make food for just one person. So you end up making it for a huge number of people and I don't do it as much anymore because I can't just make a little bit, it's always a lot and I don't want it day in and day out all the time. So on occasion, I find myself baking for other people, which brings me a lot of great joy. So absolutely in that regard.

Rick (05:13): Well, if there are listeners out there and you think we need to have a party and Charles needs to help us make it happen, let's talk about the other tasty treat that's going on out there, especially here in the Midwest cicadas, right? We got this brooded 19 that is just like overtaken our neighborhood. Are you seeing it where you live as well?

Charles K. Poole (05:31): No. One of the benefits is that I live in an apartment building that is very urban with no trees around it and no strawberry. And I am so thankful for that because I'm not seeing anything except the road cicada that somehow flies into the garage every once in a

Rick (05:48): While. Let's talk shop a little bit here. All right. I've always seen you as an intriguing personality even we're walking around one bush place. I'm going to throw some identifiers about you. Approachable, clever, smart, humble, a bunch of other stuff. How does a young man, I mean you're growing up in St. Louis area, you went to SLU Master's at Webster, which is known for having great journalism communications. First, how'd you navigate your way to the beer world and then even beyond you've gone into healthcare and some other things?

Charles K. Poole (06:21): I've gotten into this career after actually going to school. The first three years of my college experience on pre-Med, I was about to take the medical test missions testing, whatever it was called, and I decided I didn't want to do it, and then I tried on successive majors and ended up taking on communications and journalism and fell in love. So I just kind of have always approached this career from let me do what I do, but do it in different verticals, different types of organizations so that I can apply that skill there and continue to learn. At the same time. I ended up coming to Anheuser-Busch after actually having one year of experience at Fleischman Hillard working on the Anheuser-Busch account. And in the course of that year, they were starting to bring people that asked me to join them and I did and spent nearly 15 years there in a variety of roles and responsibilities and it was the best job or series of jobs I should say.

Rick (07:13): Let's talk about some of the places you've been since then. Ascension Health. I've got City Mortgage on the list, a few other places. I think you're at Equifax now, but comms is right in the heart of you kind of found your sweet spot and you kind of found your work calling, if you will.

Charles K. Poole (07:28): Well, the profession I have is a combination of the litany of things that fall under the umbrella of communications. I mean there's marketing, there's obviously the, there's the advocacy work, there's the public affairs, community relations, I've done all of it. My career has been built on trying to do things that interest me and again, allow me to grow. So all of those jobs that you've mentioned and others as well have been born with me simply trying to make sure that I was constantly sharpening my knife on stone instead of wood. And that's what I continued to do with my career because I was for the first time last year thinking I might retire, but I love this too much. So until such time that I stopped loving what I do, I'm going to continue to do it with other organizations as long as I possibly can.

Rick (08:13): I tell you what, if you're listening, you're like, okay, there's little nuggets here. Just great little life nuggets of sharpening on stone, not on wood, always being sharp, always being curious, right? I'm going to throw a little Ted lasso at you. Be curious, I'm curious about this too. On your LinkedIn profile, you list yourself as your own CEO and have, I think it dates back to maybe 2008. Why'd you do that? I think that is kind of a real cool idea, but you kind of are your own guy.

Charles K. Poole (08:44): Yeah, my day job is separate from that work in that there are tons of small organizations that can't afford an agency or to hire people that need help from time to time. I run that business to make money, never have. I've run it to provide support to those organizations that can benefit from high level counsel and skill sets that they don't necessarily have access to help them out. It's my way of being philanthropic with my skills, my knowledge, my experience, and not charging these people to do that. So that's the CEO work that is at the heart of what I do.

Rick (09:20): Well, that kind of leads into my next question. If people know you or get to know you, and they're going to know it already, just listening to you for a few minutes, but I'll throw some more adjectives. We're talking kind, thoughtful, polite. I mean I am lathering this up, but why are some of these attributes important? You're talking about giving back and all that where maybe there are other people that are trying to claw, scratch and climb that corporate ladder. You've had a different style and why has that been the right call for you?

Charles K. Poole (09:50): Yeah, I think that our legacy isn't about what's going to happen in the future, it's what we're doing in this very moment right now. And I'm wearing a T-shirt from my own collection by the way, and it says the most amazing thing I've done is to survive. When I look back at my history and what I was born, the hoax for me were fairly limited. Let's face it, you can see me, I'm a black guy. I was born in 1963. I was supposed to be in jail on drugs or dead or a combination thereof. And my life has not been that way. I've been given opportunities, I've survived a great deal of loss and I've learned what it means to be truly human. If I don't take what I've learned and apply it in a tangible way, what the hell am I here for? And so everything that I do is guided by that thinking, how can I put more good into this world than I take from it on a daily basis? And that's what drives me,

Rick (10:45): Man. That's awesome. That is inspiring. But I tell you what, you've done more than survive and on your third book you talk about thrive and I think that's something you've done. So you've been pretty meticulous about both your work and your professional and your personal lives. And this is a memory as well, and I hope I've got it right, but I remember you walking in to Anheuser-Busch and I think you had a briefcase, man, you were ready to go every day. How did you make that happen? Where'd you get that style or that professional attitude to make it happen?

Charles K. Poole (11:20): You're being very kind. There are lots of other that people use to describe me as well, folks. So I'll just say that I am self-aware after all. But the thing is, is I've been carrying a briefcase of some form since I was in elementary school, believe it or not. I have always believed in being organized, being effective in terms of knowing what I could and could not do. And that organization became part of it. So wherever I go, I have those tools that I need to make sure I can do whatever I need to do. I was so often mistaken for someone older than my chronological age, but in one instance I had to go for my sister at the time to her elementary school. I was in high school for a parent-teacher conference. My mom was sick and couldn't go. They thought for other classmates that I was her dad. I'm wearing a suit, I'm wearing a tie, I have a briefcase. And they thought I was her dad. So I'm so used to it because I really have always been much more mature than whatever my chronological age has been. And I just feel that that's a good way of being.

Rick (12:24): I like it. Can I throw a briefcase story at you and just it's reminding me of something funny from my career. Before I hit Anheuser-Busch, I was at NASCAR and there was a driver who used to get chronicled a lot. They'd always name him for every race, a driver named Dick Trickle and that was his name. He would bring a briefcase to the track and every day, and the whole rumored story was he just had an extra pair of underwear and he had cigarettes in his case, but he came in, he was ready to go. He was a little dude, he was an older gentleman, but he was a fun driver. So one time at a race there was a red flag, so that's when the cars stop on the track and there's a crash they're trying to fix and clean up and all that.

Rick (13:03): But they see smoke coming out of his car and they're like, Dick, are you okay? They're over the radio like, Hey you everything okay? There? He had just lit up a cigarette and the smoke was just watting out of the car and that's all it was. But you talk about characters in life, he was a fun character. So let's talk about, you got into you some blogging and some podcasting. You've got a book series where you talk about I Am My own Cause, which is, it's kind of interesting, but in a way everybody is is their own cause and you've got version two and you've got the third act. So man, what were you looking to do and how did you put that together?

Charles K. Poole (13:45): So fast forward, I was working for AB at the time, this was 2008, and I had moved to California, Los Angeles for the first time for them. And I was there by myself, not really aware of too many people and trying to work through a lot of things, plus trying to work through the fact that there was this huge transition that was about to happen with a new owner. And I have always believed that writing has been my catharsis. So I began writing a blog then and I titled it, I Am My Own Cause for the exact reasons you hit up upon before, I'm good to anyone else, I've got to be good to myself and understanding who I am and what I stand for is important to that. So I began writing and as I would write it and post it, I was doing it for myself.

Charles K. Poole (14:29): I always tell people I've never had to pay a therapist. I've done my own self therapy. And I started posting it and then people started responding and relating to things that I was saying and encouraging me to write more and I did. And somehow it just grew. And after a while I had enough content for a book. So I wrote a book and it was again in that vein that if it's out there and it helps someone, that's what I wanted to do. And that's what I did with the second one and the third one and saw and all of that eventually became foolproof wisdom and all of the things I do now because I want to make sure that I can use my own experiences to help people appreciate and understand the uniqueness of their own experiences and grow and learn from what I've already gone through.

Rick (15:17): Is there a little bit of an analogy when you hop on an airline and they're like, Hey, and turbulent to times the oxygen mask, we'll drop, take care of yourself before you assist a lap child or something. There's a little bit of that, isn't there?

Charles K. Poole (15:31): Right? There absolutely is because people think that taking care of yourself is selfish. That's what we're taught from the time that we're a kid. You got to be conjured to other people. What about you? We are at a crisis in this country and throughout the world when it comes to mental health, particularly as it starts with younger people because they are always trying to live into what others' expectations are for themselves without first defining it for themselves. And then you take that forward into adulthood. We have a crisis. We are ending mental health awareness month today, and I am consistently focused on making sure that people understand that there's nothing wrong with them. They need to protect and preserve their mental health because it's the way that you're able to preserve and protect your overall life.

Rick (16:16): Love it. Alright, so going a little bit further into some of the topics and things that you discussed in your book. I realize in one of your latest ones you have a section called like My mama used to say, I know Charles, you loved your mom, but you have some interesting sayings, trial and try and some others. You have a few of those little nuggets you want to share with us. And how did they come together?

Charles K. Poole (16:39): Well, some of them are a little blue, so I won't say those here, but my favorite one and the one that resonates with a lot of people, particularly in the workplaces, is that I'm not here to raise grown folks. I'm not raising grown people. And oftentimes you find, and you know this as a leader and as a manager, you have some people who get it and do what they need to do, but other people tend to whine and stuff their little feet and want all the attention. I'm not dealing with that. I'm not going to raise a 35 or 40-year-old person. So I believe in that one. Another one is I'm too old a cat to be called a kid, which primarily means I've seen a lot. Whatever you're trying to play, don't make the mistake of assuming that I haven't seen this dealt with this or lived through this before.

Charles K. Poole (17:25): So save your time. And there are hundreds of them. And the weird thing about them, Rick, they do really do come from my mom and the way that they are able to show up in my mind is that in a situation, the right phrase pops into my head at the right time when trying to think about them except for these more classic ones on a daily basis, I can't remember them, but let there be a situation where the right phrase needs to apply. Boom, there's the phrase and it just comes right out of the mouth.

Rick (17:56): Alright, give me the one about trial and try and what are the exact words because I don't want people to miss it. I think it's really well done.

Charles K. Poole (18:04): Nothing beats a trial, but a try.

Rick (18:08): There you go. I mean, come on. We should all be wearing shirts or ball caps or it's outstanding.

Charles K. Poole (18:16): I'm not going to merch my friend. You can wear

Rick (18:18): It. I know I will. Absolutely. Alright, we're going to jump back into the hot pan here a little bit with our friend Charles K Pool. Our last episode, we had a gentleman here in St. Louis called the movie man, James Thomas and I worked with him with the Black Film Festival, the St. Louis Black Film Festival. He's unbelievable. He's a guy that everybody, it seems like in the innovation community in St. Louis knows and he knows everybody. But so staying on the movie theme, is there a favorite movie out there or something that's inspiring? And I'm not going to bring up you and me and some buddies watching the movie Jackass when we were at Anheuser-Busch, which by the way was really hilarious. But is there something out there that kind of like, boy, this is me.

Charles K. Poole (18:57): Yeah, well, I love movies and a lot of what I do love are much older films. So I'm going to do this in two parts. I'll tell you my favorite film of all time and then I'll tell you something that I've watched recently that has had a great impact on me. So my favorite film is a 1950 film called All About Each during Betty Davis. It is a character study unlike any other. It's in black and white and the lines the wit. The writing of this film and the portrayals of the characters is unparalleled as a person who bases a lot of what I do professionally on behavioral understanding. It's a behavioral study like any unlike any other. And I have watched that movie probably at least a thousand times by now. So that's my favorite movie. And something I've been watching that I watched recently, which still resonates with me, is Origin, which is based on a book, the Movies by Ava DuVernay, but it's based up on a book called Caste. The Origin of our Discontent, and I won't go into details if anyone hasn't seen it, but it really brings to a very clear point why so much of what we deal with in this country challenges us all. So I would say that the movie and the book represent that for me.

Rick (20:19): Well, you're talking about great movies and great writing is always behind those kind of movies. Speaking of writers and books and blogs, are there certain people that maybe you follow, whether it's an author or a speaker or a celebrity that maybe you get a little bit of inspiration on as well?

Charles K. Poole (20:37): I probably think if you go into my queue for what I have read or am about to read, I'm a huge fan of biographies because what I like learning about a book that still resonates with me because what happened after he created and delivered the book was so sad is Matthew Perry's bio. And to have read that and then find him in a place where it seemed that he had made it, he had a life again, he was back on track. And then for him to tragic die as he did, I felt like I knew more about him than I would have other than the roles he played. And that's the reason it's probably my favorite genre book is the biography. I always believe that if you really want to know what it means to be truly human, look at other people's stories and then reflect your own journey along that

Rick (21:31): Path. In a lot of ways people felt like he was a friend of everybody. I mean, no pun intended, but for sure. How about a quote? Is there a quote or maybe a life lesson or something that you're like, boy, that's just part of my DNA now as well.

Charles K. Poole (21:45): It's all going to be okay.

Rick (21:47): It's all going to be okay. That's the one.

Charles K. Poole (21:50): And that too came from a mouth. So I would say it's that one followed by this other one. As I tell you, all of the stuff that I love, postulate, foolproof wisdom, it came from a mouth, but the other one was child, I want you to always know you are not your circumstances. So those two,

Rick (22:07): Those are good, but I always going to be okay. And it reminds me I'm a big Tom Petty and the Heartbreakers fan and Tom Petty had in a couple of his songs and most things that I worry about never happen anyway, which I think is really an interesting line and it kind of goes along like, Hey, this can be okay.

Charles K. Poole (22:24): I stress that is the truth. And something I often find myself doing is you counsel people directly, indirectly, but I always remind them, remember that one thing over however many years ago and there have been multiple instances that you had this great fear of and you were so sure was going to end you and you're still here. Well, that's evidence that a hundred percent of your worst fears you've already survived. So why fear anything else if you've already come through your greatest fears? That's pretty much all the proof you need to understand that you're going to make it so it dovetails into that. It's all going to be okay making.

Rick (23:02): I have to bring up the proof you just said that's proof that you're going to make it, but I'm looking at your logo for pool proof and you've got a capital PR for the word proof, right? Is there a little PR piece in there as well?

Charles K. Poole (23:13): Of course is it's represe. That logo is representative of who I am. It's a logo of a kid sitting under a tree reading book. That was me when I was coming up. And I have represented elements of who I have been and who I am and who I'm hoping to become in that logo. There's even a little thing there that most people don't notice that you look at the end of foolproof wisdom. And then there are these two little dots above one of the letters that represents my late brother and sister who always were with me and guiding me in their own individual ways. So the logo is really about who I've been, who I am, and who I'm hoping to become.

Rick (23:52): I like it. It's deeper than just at first blush.

Charles K. Poole (23:55): I always like to think that I'm a little bit deeper than the first blush.

Rick (23:58): There you go. Alright, so we're talking to our friend Charles Cape Pool. If you have a question form or maybe you want to stay in touch after the fact, we do have an email. It's the oven light@abmurray.com. Send us a note, send a note to Charles if you want to know more or stay connected. Maybe we'll send you some swag. Seriously, we want letters. We want people to reach out to us. Maybe we even send you some pizza cutters and who knows some stuff from the baking side. Yeah, some swag, but all right, we're going to get back on topic here. So public speaking, some people think it's worse than death. We were just talking about fears and all that. Why is communication come easy to you and how do you maintain that skill and is it a perishable

Charles K. Poole (24:39): Skill? My mom said that came out of the womb asking what took so long. So I have been talking from the moment that I could, right? Communicating is so much easier than we humans make it. And I like the fact that I can provide people opportunities to learn how they can do it better. They appreciate that. For me, it's innate. I tell people all the time, I'm an extra speaker, give me a topic, I'll talk on it. And then the third prong of this, Rick, is that I find that I really do in most instances, enjoy people. Having a conversation is my favorite past. It gives me joy, it informs me and it makes me think about possibilities. So I figure that I was born into this and given this ability to do exactly those things professionally, personally, and in terms of my own growth. So that's what I find so useful about being a communicator and doing it in the natural way I have, because I didn't do anything except learn the edicts of communication in school. But the nuances and the implications, that's all native foreign as I like to say.

Rick (25:53): Well, I'm going to tap into another comment. You talked about your growth and we talked about LA and your love for the area, but you shook your life up a little bit by going to the west coast. Why do you think it's important once in a while to keep things on the non level? You shake up your world a little bit or do something maybe outside of your comfort zone?

Charles K. Poole (26:13): I've actually done it several times. I call it burning my life down. I think that if you take anything from the idea of what a phoenix is, right, it goes through those flames and it comes out anew renewed, and as a result, it's the better for it. If you don't go through something, I think that you kind of are missing out on life. I've talked to people who have had what perceivably would be a fairly simple, easy life, but when you look at their experiential level, they just don't understand how good they got it because they've never been through anything on the other side. So I always enjoy breaking it down, burning it down, and coming out on that other side with the additional knowledge and perspective so that I can use it for whatever comes next in my life. Because if you are comfortable, I think that that's boring. I think that it's boring to be comfortable. I want to constantly be in a position where I am growing and changing and becoming. Because if you look at your own self from 10 years ago, Rick, you are not the same person today. So that's growth. And you should want that, and you should give it to yourself as often as you

Rick (27:20): Can. You're not talking about a few extra pounds here, are you? Because I don't appreciate that comment. Charles,

Charles K. Poole (27:24): You talk about weight. Seriously. I mean, I can go toe to toe with you on that one,

Rick (27:31): But hey, through all your travels and your treks, you kind of found coming back home to St. Louis. What's that been like? They say you can't come home again, but obviously you have.

Charles K. Poole (27:42): Well, home is where you are. It's not a physical location. No matter who I am, no matter where I am, no matter what I'm doing, I have home in my head, in my heart, always. There are things that I very much enjoy about my hometown. There are things that I'm just like, really, we're still doing this right? But it's kind of like family, right? No matter who they are, no matter what you do, whether there's love, whether there's understanding, there can be appreciation. And that's what I find here. I've left many times and I've come back at, interestingly, in this particular point of time, I find that because of who I am today, I am appreciating more about what this place is than I had when I was younger. And I think that's what it's representative of, the growth of the individual who has seen other things but can still appreciate what you already have.

Rick (28:32): Well, I tell you what, if you've enjoyed listening to Charles, I have as well, and we're going to figure out a time to go visit a little bakery or a little coffee shop. Enjoy some additional conversation. Alright, before we let you go, one last thing. How do people stay in touch with you if they want to know more about Pool Proof wisdom, some of your books, your blogs, how do they stay in touch with you

Charles K. Poole (28:55): All over the place? Social media wise, all of it's under a foolproof umbrella. Whether it's Foolproof Wisdom or Foolproof Wisdom podcast, you can respond and engage in that way. Instagram, tick link, you name it, I'm on it and I do respond because people's interest is important to me. So if you have any of those applications, I'm on there. Look for it and guess something you want to ask, please feel free to do so, and I will definitely respond.

Rick (29:26): Charles, great to have you on the program. That's it for this episode. We thank our good friend again, Charles K. Poole, as cool as the other side of the pillow as I referred him to for joining us. For now, the switch is off the oven, light is off. Thanks for joining us, and

Intro/Outro (29:40): We look forward to connecting with you again soon. Cheers. We hope you've enjoyed this episode of The Oven Light. Until next time, when we discuss more about the wonderful world of baking, technology trends and more, the switch is officially off. Goodbye for now. See you next time.